ACC moves are nothing like Big12/Pac?/A&M
by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 8:06 PM EDT
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PrintI can't get enough of expansion talk, but one thing is starting to bother me. I keep reading everywhere about greed and the loss of integrity among the college football landscape and university presidents. And most of that is probably true. Texas A&M abandoned their conference because they were mad at 1 school. That school, Texas, is playing their own conference by threatening to leave just to show they have that power and that a conference NEEDS them, they don't need a conference. (Anybody remember Stillwater? No, I'm not talking about OklaSt, but he band from 'Almost Famous') They don't care about leaving or staying in the Big12. The Pac? is trying to solidify themselves as a top football conference but they have to be careful or their fate 20 years from now could be like the Big East today...
I was born in Syracuse and have loved the Big East. It's sad to see a charter member leave and the ramifications of possibly ending some terrific rivalries that had been formed in the conference. However, don't assume that this move is anything like what is happening west of us. Is there greed and integrity issues in the ACC, like all other conferences? Absolutely. But before you start calling the ACC 'snakes' and bashing Pitt and Syracuse, be open to the possibility that this makes sense in every other way and more money also happens to be a by product... Which is why this is a no brainer (and the Big East will eventually be better for it)
The schools that comprise the Big East don't mesh, and it was only a matter of time before something happened to this conference. Football members, basketball members and simply the schools themselves all have different priorities. There is no unified direction for the conference that involves all the schools. In 1982 the Big East decided it was not a football conference by rejecting the addition of Penn State, and so it continued developing a fantastic basketball base. But some of the schools already in the Big East actually have storied football programs, what are they to do? The Big East's goal was to be a basketball conference for smaller "big-time", religious? institutions, and it's accomplished that. But besides saying that they were in the same conference, some schools had no other connections or similarities, which means it's impossible for the Big East to make everyone happy. It's sad to see it happen but good for Syracuse and Pitt. They DO fit with the ACC in every facet. That's why this happened sooo quickly. This decision was not- 'Oh, lets put together the top 16 schools in the country regardless of location, cultural similarities and academic missions because we could negotiate a huge TV contract'. The ACC wins because they added 2 universities that will mesh instantly and have the same agenda as the current 12 schools... AND it happens to extend the ACC brand into new places (more money), why would the ACC or Pitt/Cuse not do this?
Now if the ACC goes out this week and grabs Texas and Kansas because OU goes to Pac-12... then I'll agree with some of you and sports analysts about the greed behind the ACC. But for now, no.
And if the Big East were smart, they should concentrate their effort on continuing to do what they set out to do years ago... form a top non-football conference. They still have amazing institutions to base that around, and there are other schools out there in smaller conferences that fit their profile and have shown they have extremely successful basketball programs. Even if football is the big money, the Big East could be successful for years to come without it. Don't go out and just add all these schools with football programs that will pull in money. Or some years from now the same thing will happen because besides all joining the Big East to stay afloat... thats where the institutions similarities will stop.
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Be gentle...
It’s my first FanPost. Nah, I got think skin… lay it on me
Save the Bay
by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 8:15 PM EDT reply actions
I think you're on to something
Mostly because the ACC doesn’t seem to be in any rush to add Rutgers and UConn, despite heavy interest on the schools’ parts. If they were just about expanding for the sake of it, those two would have received an invite this afternoon, with basketball-only nods to Georgetown and Villanova immediately after. If they end up staying at 14, what you say is probably correct.
If they make a power move and grab Notre Dame though, I can’t say they’re any different than the other leagues. We’ll see though, I suppose. Plenty more news to come.
Find me on the Twitters: @JohnCassillo
Right?...
All these prolonged talks between schools and other conferences seem to be negotiations about who gets what and how much. The speed at which this got done I think shines a light on what was an obvious compatibility.
Thank you for making my first comment not about my terrible writing skills and grammar, which is probably at a 9th grade level.
Save the Bay
by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions
No non-football invitations. Ever.
If the ACC wouldn’t take in Texas or Notre Dame for its non-football sports, it shouldn’t take Georgetown or Villanova. End of story.
Honestly
It seemed like a survival move, mostly. Dont get me wrong I think big conferences are great for bball cause you play alot more game but fball it is kind of pointless.
Premature Exacerbation?
Some people would say that if they hadn’t moved everything could have been alright for the Big East. And that the move now created survival mode for others?… But what you say I think supports the ACC decision. It doesn’t always seem like the best option in football just to have more teams, even though that means more money. But it’s probably worth it if you gain in every other part of your conference as well.
Save the Bay
by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 9:10 PM EDT up reply actions
UCONN I'm not fully against
As much as I want the ACC to dominate the whole east coast and the lack of a dominant pro sports team (Talkin about Rutgers now, Yes Devils and Nets are there but not really huge sports focus I think) I don’t want rutgers at all. UCONN does bring in the Connecticut market and even people that went to others colleges who live in Conn. love UCONN. Thats just how it is without a team in the state. WVU I’m totally for. People seem to like to hate on WVU academics and they are bad don’t get me wrong but they fit in and bring in another market. If we got WVU and UCONN I would be pretty happy. Navy has not been mentioned much but I would really be against it considering it would put another MD school in the ACC. Just my thoughts.
UCLA who?
Sorry
Thought I hit reply… Below is my reply to you (I love WVU)
Save the Bay
by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 9:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Let Connecticut twist in the wind
I’m rather have Temple than UConn and their obnoxious, nouveau riche fan base.
Not saying I agree but
to qoute Juno “…your little girlfriend gave me the stink eye”, “what? No? that’s just her face…”
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by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I love WVU..
A lot of my friends went there, and I love the rivalry they have with maryland and, of course, with Pitt. However, if the ACC brings in WVU it will show that their only motive is greed. WVU has great teams in the 2 biggest sports (Football and Basketball) and would certainly spell more money for the conference. But WVU, in the broadest sense, is not a ACC type school. I DON’T mean that in a derogatory way at all. I’ve been to Morgantown. I have gone to football games there. SO much fun. But I would liken those trips more to my visits to South Carolina and Tennessee… than to BC, UVA, UNC and Duke. I think the SEC would be stupid to expand without taking WVU.
Being a Marylander, I would love to regularly associate with Navy. Unfortunately, we would be the only school in the ACC that will think about giving Navy the nod in. So hopefully, even without the conference affiliation, Maryland keeps a spot in the schedule open each year for them.
I’ve been wrestling with what I want the ACC to do from here. A part of me wants Notre Dame… because its NOTRE FREAKIN DAME! It would bring in ridiculous amounts of money but its a stretch to say they fit the ACC profile. And I really want to keep defending the ACC as not being completely corrupted by money. SO, I think I’ve decided I want the ACC to stay how it is now or add UConn and Penn St. It’s either both or do nothing. UConn fits in the ACC and brings a more northern market but it’s true contribution is it’s basketball team. If the ACC brings them in they need a 2nd team that is a football school because the big football schools in the ACC need to have their feelings considered. Hence, Penn St. After being at Penn St multiple times, I truely believe they are the university of maryland in a completely different geographical environment.
Save the Bay
by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 9:35 PM EDT reply actions
with a much more storied football program
by terpfan2011 on Sep 19, 2011 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Great post IMO
I agree with 97% of what you have said. I’ve been banging the Penn State drum to just about anyone that will listen. The only thing I really disagree with you on is that if Notre Dame applies, you accept them yesterday. I agree with you and love the fact it doesn’t seem to be all about the money to this point, but when it comes to ND, you don’t cut off your nose to spite your face IMO. Sure they’re not the greatest geographical fit, but it’s not as if they’re Texas. They’re close enough to make sense, and as a Maryland fan, any extra money we can get I’ll gladly take at this point. Plus, it seems like everyone seems to want UConn, but I wouldn’t doubt the fact that they’re one mass text away from being on at least a semi-serious probation.
by FeartheTurtle2002 on Sep 19, 2011 10:24 PM EDT up reply actions
haha.. (mass text)
I wasn’t even thinking about current sanctions, but I’d believe that even with a 3-5 year probation UConn could make a strong case.
On the other hand, PSU and ND addition? I think I’d let the entire country call the ACC greedy and… I’d just smile.
Save the Bay
by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 19, 2011 10:33 PM EDT reply actions
On Notre Dame...
Redterp02 provided this in another post. “Notre Dame should jump to the ACC… and fast” http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=dw-wetzel_notre_dame_should_jump_to_acc_091911
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by NattyBoAndOldBay on Sep 20, 2011 12:46 AM EDT reply actions
Let's Be Honest
The ACC is a brand/business. If people call the ACC greedy for making GOOD business decisions for the longevity of their conference, that is just plain dumb.
I agree wholeheartedly with this post. Pitt and Cuse fit the ACC profile to a tee. Excellent basketball programs, decent football programs, and good academics.
Even thinking about taking WVU is a joke. A lot of you were straight clowning on their academics leading up to the football game, soooo what has changed since then? They are not an ACC caliber school and if I sound elitist, it’s because I am being elitist. Let the SEC take them, which should be renamed to DAC (Dumb Athlete Conference). I kid.
Taking Notre Dame or PSU or both is just good business sense, but would sort of convolute the ACCs identity as a basketball conference. This may balance out with the BCs, FSUs, Clemsons of the world. Plus there is no way everyone gets an equal piece of that pie.
Sidenote: How long will Joe P coach? Like will he be on his deathbed calling plays?? I know he has basically earned that right, but still. Hang it up.
*All Terp Everything*
Joe PA an embarassment
I agree 100%. I caught highlights of the end of the Penn State game and annnouncers said somewhere behind the glass Joe Pa is celebrating win # whatever. He can’t even be on the field anymore and does nothing in the booth. All his assistants who have stayed by his side for all these years must be kicking themselves.
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