Uh Oh: DeMatha Football, New Maryland Staff Have Already Established Poor Relationship
I don't think it's reached "rift" status quite yet, but it's getting there. Emphasis mine.
"We've reached out and we haven't yet heard anything. We're concerned because we want to maintain a relationship or at least establish a relationship with Maryland so our players can [potentially] have a bright future there like past players.
"It's odd. We have kids there that are successful currently. We're right down the road from Maryland. I am bewildered that we haven't established some sort of relationship." [...]
"[WR coach Lee Hull] said he didn't want to see any kids, that they didn't have any [DeMatha] players on the radar and that they had offered enough kids," Cunningham said. "They had offered [rising senior linebacker Sam] Lebbie when Ralph [Friedgen] was there and they pulled the offer, said they were recruiting a different kind of kid.
"We're here all spring, they have a six-week open period. They come the last week and say point-blank, ‘We don't want to see any of your kids'? ... The odds are, in the future, we will have players they are interested in. So I am definitely bothered there is no relationship attempted to be made, for future players at the least."
Ladies and gentlemen, Randy Edsall, the football version of mid-2000s Gary Williams.
Edsall's very obviously a no-BS, no-politics guy. Problem is, football recruiting, very much like basketball recruiting, is political. These coaches have influence on their players, and if you disrespect them by showing no interest in forming a relationship, you might have some trouble down the line, as DeMatha's coach alludes to. Recruiting, in most cases, is relationships.
I understand where Edsall's coming from. DeMatha has minimal talent this year. And without legendary coach Bill McGregor, it's very possible that their reign atop the WCAC is done, particularly with Good Counsel rising. New coach Elijah Brooks, a 27-year-old four years removed from college, isn't exactly the same big draw that McGregor, one of the most respected HS football coaches in the country, was. In fact, if there was a single local powerhouse that Maryland had to damage its relationship with, DeMatha would probably be the one I pick.
But, uh, I'd prefer it if Edsall could could avoid damaging ties with any local powerhouse. Seriously, would it be too much to just look at Dan Collura or Richard Webb, of offer one of DeMatha's committed four-stars? Don't even spend too much time or try to land them; just make it look like you care about the DC area's best football team over the past decade?
The "revoking Sam Lebbie's scholarship" thing is especially grating. That's just a slap in the face. Heck, the relationship was pre-built there. It's like they went out of their way to destroy it. (They obviously didn't, but it sure seems that way.)
Remember when Devin Burns had his scholarship revoked by Georgia? Carver's coach essentially said "Georgia is no longer welcome here." Wait, no, he said that exactly. And that's Georgia, which last time I checked had a bit more wiggle room than Maryland. (UGA supposedly had to "re-offer" Burns after his Maryland commit to regain access.)
It doesn't appear that DeMatha has a star in the pipeline at the moment. Friendship in DC and Good Counsel are the powerhouses for the present and near future. But when one emerges - and DM has too money for one not to - or when Edsall decides that 2013 RB Juan Carlos Mao-Alston is "his type of guy", perhaps Brooks might not be too welcoming.
Edsall's Gary-like no-BS approach will work with some. But by it's very nature it will burn its fair share of bridges, too. Oh well. Let's just hope he can have Gary-like success.
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Its pathetic
Dematha is literally 5-10 mins down Rt 1.
I understand that there might not be any kids there worth getting this year, but if there is one thing you shouldn’t do is burn bridges before they’re even built.
Nobody on here has mentioned the issue with the Levenberry kid either yet
Cant provide the link now, but Josh Barr at the Post had a blog entry on Levenberry- his Dad was fired up that MD hadnt even talked to them. I dont know details, but a kid that Oklahoma is recruiting cant be that bad
Levenberry will not be staying in the area. Big FSU fan and also likes Bama.
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urghhhhhh
don’t like this at all…think I actually saw a fireedsall already but may have to change my poster name if this is true.
if that is actually the case edsall is in the wrong. the smart common sense thing to do is stop by for a meet and greet and say if anyone peaks their interest they will contact the coach. the whole thing would take 45 min including the time to leave his office go to dematha and get back to his office. i’ve heard this yr’s recruiting class ranks about # 50 in the country.
Dematha Football is one thing
but they better not compromise the relationship with Dematha bball…need Bee Jay Anya to be a terp!
I'll go drive down to DeMatha and sit around for six weeks 2 meet and greet if I could
just to show my UMD football face – crap, I’ll work for nothing on an “internship” and just scout away!
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
Surprised a 27 year old...
high school coach is amping this up. At 27, I would think you would have a little less ego and maybe try and cultivate the relationship from your side. After all Edsall has earned his stripes, not sure about the new coach at Dematha.
the DM coach doesn't have to cultivate ANYTHING,
it’s Edsall that has to do the cultivating!
You make my pee-pee maker t-t-tingle.
WHAT!!!
Yeah right. When you have $100k + scholarships to give to a very fortunate and privileged few, YOU don’t kiss any ones butt….. Now! The Coach on the other hand has an obligation to do their best to land the student -athlete in the best collegiate situation possible. It would be beneficial for both to communicate with each other and at least be cordial. By blabbing it to the press shows his immaturity. He must be new to the game.
by TwerpsNoMore on Jul 29, 2011 8:30 PM EDT up reply actions
This would be true if Maryland was the only school for DM athletes
But every school in the country knows about DM, watches DM film and games, and recruits DM players. Every school in the country. When multiple schools are offering scholarships, as they will, you need to do the cultivating. DM doesn’t rely on UMD.
Youre right in some respects
But also rememeber that Dematha’s status in football was built on McGregors record, and basketball on the strength of Morgan Wooten- Dematha is a private school and needs to recruit to get their own players. Good Counsel and others have quality programs that can compete for these kids. Dematha and this new coach do need to do their own cultivating to continue to stay as successful as they have, and this guy piping off to the media about his lack of a relationship with a college coach just shows a complete lack of class and maturity, at best
Not to mention I have a bone to pick...
…with Dematha anyway. How many of their best players do we watch go to Penn State and elsewhere?
The street goes two ways, and it is a street that has been traveled for many, many years.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 29, 2011 10:10 PM EDT up reply actions
I would agree with that, but wouldn't the new coaching staffs in both sports signal an opportunity to change that?
Well!!!
Apparently it must not be the new regime. Sounds like the same old same old. I doubt very seriously that Randy came to town firing on all cylinders as he was and is doing without contacting a major talent pool. No matter what anyone says….. it doesn’t add up and it doesn’t make sense…… at all!!! I believe the issue is at DM. My .02c
by TwerpsNoMore on Jul 29, 2011 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions
Don't give Penn State so much credit.
How many Penn State players from Dematha.
http://pennstate.scout.com/a.z?s=157&p=8&c=2&nid=688&yr=2011
No doubt Penn State is on a...
…decline of sorts. Kind of in a holding pattern until JoePa either retires, or dies.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 9:58 PM EDT up reply actions
But just when we think JoePa is done
he keeps bringing (the recruits) me back!
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 30, 2011 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions
The man is...
84 years old.
I don’t see that as a positive for Penn State. They won’t fire or force him to retire. But you gotta know it’s just a matter of time.
I bet he doesn’t even know half the players names who play for Penn State.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions
DeMatha
puts out more D1 prospects than any school in the nation!!! Getting in good with them shoulda been one of Edsells top priorities recruiting wise.
by MoCounty11 on Jul 29, 2011 3:58 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
And how many of their BEST...
…go to Maryland? You’d think Dematha was Penn State High School if you’d look at where theyr best players go.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 29, 2011 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions
They want to get away from their families and the issues that lie within.... I GUESS.
It always perturbed me watching local talent going to a program on the same level as us. I could see the southland for the climate…. BUT PS!!!! That’s a slap in the face and a lot of DM athletes have done just that.
by TwerpsNoMore on Jul 29, 2011 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions
you need to read the article in the post. what’s written here isn’t the whole story. yellow journalism
You mean the article linked?
I feel this represented the important points pretty well. The rest of the article is mostly elaboration or denials from Edsall, but what did you think he was going to say?
The only other meaningful quote was from Cunningham, saying that they were welcomed to practice, but that doesn’t change the more important points that the most recent communication between the two has been negative. To be fair, the part where Loh doesn’t talk about football to DM’s principal was also left out, which makes the entire situation look even worse, but I feel that Loh isn’t that tuned into the athletic culture of UMD.
Ben Your Postings are appreciated as always
and although I have not read the posted article that is being referred to I wonder like many why a young local head coach would air his dirty laundry unless Randy responded in kind to a slight delivered by said young head coach. Regardless a high school head coach is truly not as significant in directing a high school football player as one might like to think. These young kids choose a school for so many different factors: Their favorite team growing up, it’s local so their parents can watch them play, It’s far away so they can get away from parental supervision, a recruiter has made a great pitch, a program is perceived as being able to win a NC, a friend (or girlfriend is going there), Grandma lives nearby that school, great party school, great weather (San Diego where I live), great reputation in their major, that school won the National Championship last year, the list goes on and on. Likewise kids reject a local school for various reasons as well: There has been a change of coaches, bad publicity from or about a former player from his high school, lack of perceived potential immediate playing time, doesn’t like the dorms or other facilities, doesn’t like the perceived social life. The head football coach is probably somewhere below all of these.
by clevesanterp on Jul 29, 2011 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Here we go again!
It’s obvious that no matter what he does, there will be people on both sides of the fence. I doubt very seriously that Randy would disrespect a program with a juggernaut of talent within a stones throw away without a reason. It’s not like he is playing solitaire on his PC to kill time.
Let the man do his job, his way. He’s the one that’s going to get stoned in public if all these changes and under the radar players don’t pan out. I for one, can’t wait to park my butt at Byrd and watch us destroy Miami.
Of course he has a reason
Question is, is the reason a good one? If his reason is that he’s not “a political kind of guy” and doesn’t like to build relationships for the sake of building relationships, well, that’s a shitty reason. If he has a good reason … well, I don’t know what that good reason is.
Everyone here can’t wait for the Miami game and will be rooting for MD to win. I’m tired of the fan card.
100% agreed
I can’t wait for football season, and can’t stop talking trash about how Maryland football is underrated. That being said, I’m allowed to be objective when talking amongst my fellow fans.
Gary Williams had a very long leash when it came to recruiting. One reason (another is that he won, a lot), is that when he started, recruiting did not involve kissing ass. In other words, some people respected Gary for refusing to change, even thought other coaches started to just kiss ass.
I don’t think Edsall gets that same leash—he isn’t a Gary Williams that gets the benefit of the doubt in the “refuse to play ball” debate.
Everyone here will say that we need to wait to judge—and thats true. But wow, his tenure has done very little to inspire confidence thus far.
DM Coach
I agree this looks bad. But, the new DM caoch also needs to watch himself. IF, and I know its a big IF, MD ever gets to be a sold top 20 program again, he will need MD more than MD needs DM. Even if he felt that way, WHY would he run his mouth about this to the press? Stupid.
good post
I didn’t think of that at first. If either side has an issue, pick up the phone and make a call and keep it “in house.” great point – I guess that constitutes “Old Skool?” Or just general decency and good practice?
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 29, 2011 4:46 PM EDT up reply actions
why does dematha need maryland. md isn’t the only d 1 football program in the country. md needs dematha more because they will probably have many top players for d 1 programs in the future and it’s important to recruit well in your own backyard.
if a HS coach steers away a player
because of a perceived slight, and his player was a good fit there for a future pro career, then that is what’s wrong with HS athletics, whether HS or AAU. You put your ego aside and do what’s best for your kids.
This may be getting blown out of proportion, or the new coach wants a lot more attention than a staff trying to make up recruiting ground all year, has the “extra” time for. I do not know the inside scoop, maybe one of you can hear some off the record tidbits this weekend.
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 29, 2011 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Agreed.
If he has a problem (real or imagined) then he should make a sincere effort to air it out with Edsall first, not in the press – it just seems puerile.
Why would the DM coach ever NEED UMd?
Last I checked 100+ schools play D-1 football. Does it really matter to him if UMd gets a kid or if it’s Boston College or PSU?
"Complacency is your demise." - Kerry King
lets hope Edsall has Ralph-like success!
otherwise, smh, just cut football and concentrate solely on men’s bball!
You make my pee-pee maker t-t-tingle.
Randy edsall is a blow hard. Do you ppl think he is this way because at his last school he had ppl getting killed?… Id like 2 c turge treat montrose like a step child (sorry montrose grads)
by valenciais1 on Jul 29, 2011 5:22 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
a red headed one?
lol
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 29, 2011 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Could someone explain...
What have the Stages done for either Terps football or basketball in the last 25 years?
Dikaia Upotheke - Justice Our Foundation
Ummmmm
It only took two (2) months for this guy to have his nose bent out of joint? It also was that quick to put quotes in the press? This seems to me to be a DM Coach problem then an Edsall problem. (I also haven’t heard this from anyone else. In fact, all other HS Coaches speak only positively.).
by 7YearGrad on Jul 29, 2011 7:37 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
But your posting seems to place the blame entirely on Edsall. If the DM Coach is a jerk (all indications…) then the program is stronger for Edsall keeping his principles.
by 7YearGrad on Jul 29, 2011 8:29 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
No, I don't think it is
You have to deal with some pretty unpleasant people in this business. I don’t care if Elijah is a major asshole – and for clarification’s sake, I’m not saying he actually is one – if keeping that door open leads to another Kenny Tate, you do it. The program won’t be stronger for Edsall refusing to put up with someone he doesn’t like or lowering his ego enough to make Elijah feel big.
One F'n Player?
Tate is an awesome player, but am I really worried about losing contact to a HS that only one player (out of many former DM players who went elsewhere) made a difference for the Terps? I would much rather Edsall be even handed across all area high schools. I think he is showing every other football coach that he will not play favorites. Coaches will respect that. THAT will make the program stronger!!!
by 7YearGrad on Jul 30, 2011 8:56 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
My point is that there's no upside
Don’t play favorites, but don’t cut ties w/ DM. Just show them some love. No HS coach (except Milloy) will respect Edsall standing up DM.
Edsall Standing Up To Whom???
Is RE really standing up to DM? How? By revoking a schollie from a lb who no longer will fit a system? Or is he not showing the looooove to a brand new coach who somehow is expecting favors? I am sure being head coach at MD is difficult enough than to worry about the hurt feelings of a 27 year old. I think the consistency of Edsall will win out over fans, recruits, and yes the coaches of major high school programs. (BTW-I am sure the powers that be at DM did not like the comments of the fb coach)
by 7YearGrad on Jul 30, 2011 10:58 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I think he meant...
…standing him up. Not standing up to him. There is a difference.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 10:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Just curious
What would you put in the “positives” category and what would you put in the “negatives”?
From what I can tell, people like Edsall because he gave a few good speeches about how he has always wanted to coach at Maryland, and how he is a disciplinarian.
While his recruiting hasn’t been bad, it hasn’t been anything special.
I just don’t see how we upgraded over Fridge, other than the fact that we have a younger, healthier coach.
I was referring to recruiting in particular
And while Edsall hasn’t killed it, he’s done a pretty good job at building relationships. I’m not exaggerating when I say that MD has a legitimate chance at both Stefon Diggs and Noah Spence, both of which are in large part due to the way Edsall appeals to their parents. Maryland is Noah’s dad’s choice, and even if it isn’t Noah’s right now, that means MD will be in it until the end.
And right after he was hired, a lot of HS coaches in the area said they were impressed by him. Obviously, it’s easy to be “impressed” when there’s nothing to do; stuff like this will make or break. But at places like GC and even Gilman things are smooth. Staff’s been very active in building in-roads in PA, too, and I imagine they’ll go back to the Pittsburgh-area well next year, too.
In general, I feel like you’re pretty much right that we didn’t get a big improvement. That doesn’t mean we didn’t need a change. And with UA down the pipe, all Edsall needs to do for the moment is hold the ship together. Once the reinforcements arrive in the form of Kevin Plank money, the new unis, the indoor practice facility, etc., either the results will pour in or it’ll be painfully obvious we need someone else.
We didn't get a big improvement?
This class, if we don’t close on a couple of the big-time kids we’re chasing, will be easily the lowest-ranked Maryland class in the modern era of highly publicized recruiting. It’s a big step back right now. This notion of recruiting a certain type of kid, like the DM coach references, is scary to me. That certain type of kid seems to be an unknown, unranked kid who had no other offers. We’re building the University of Southern UConn right now.
Everybody wants to “just trust” Edsall or “just let him do his job” but he’s not doing it so far in recruiting. You can’t win with poorly ranked recruiting classes. Not in a major confererence. You can if you’re Boise St or Utah and 9 of your 11 games are against Idaho State and Wyoming, but you can’t do that in the ACC. You have 1 good year and then a bunch of other years and then hopefully 1 good year again. That’s the best-case scenario if you aren’t bringing big-time athletes into a big-time conference program.
I like Edsall. I’m rooting for Edsall, but Edsall is doing a poor job recruiting so far. This is a poor class so far. And blowing off DM is the last thing on earth he should be doing.
what classes did Edsall win with at UConn?
Anyone have that research?
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 30, 2011 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions
"winning" at UConn
Edsall won a weak conference last year. They lost, what, 3 games? 4 games? Same as Maryland? They may not have beaten Maryland last year had they played, let alone FSU or VT or Clemson. His UConn teams were sporty and overachieving but lacked the talent of a true BCS contender. I believe their 4-touchdown loss to OU in their BCS bowl reflected that they were in over their heads talentwise.
I do not want Maryland to be the little guys with the big hearts who can pull off an upset if you don’t take them seriously enough. I want good talent, players, good program. It really does all go hand in hand. This recruiting class is a Wake Forest or UConn caliber class. Duke — DUKE!!! — has a higher rated class right now.
They lost 5 games ....
…to answer my own question. UConn had 5 losses last year, 1 more than Maryland did.
Edsall built his reputation by overachieving with marginal talent.
Man...
you just gotta let go of that star system for long enough to breath.
When Edsall is losing games four years from now, I’ll be with you. But you can’t judge a recruiting class at least until three years in. Period.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
three years in ....
…is too late. The star system matters. Talent matters. You can’t have all sleepers.
but for balance
I will not detail it, but I pointed out what Beamer’s done at VaTach compared to his recruiting classes. Their final ranking almost always exceeds recruiting class ranking. And they do not get many 5 stars at all.
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
And pretty much every year, Va Tech
can beat all the average teams they play, but lose to the true elites.
Beamer, Bud Foster, and staff are great coaches—some of the best in the business. If I recall correctly, they get mostly 3 and 4 stars—an even balance between the two. They play a schedule full of games against the ACC—at least half of which they easily outrecruit (Maryland, Wake, Duke, UVA, State, Boston College). Then coaching takes over—and they move ahead of another couple teams (Miami, UNC, Clemson).
That leaves FSU and Georgia Tech as teams with good (or better) recruiting and good coaching—not surprisingly, those teams have battled Va. Tech for ACC supremacy the last few years.
Getting a 5 star doesn’t mean that much if you can’t coach it—look at Clemson’s recruiting classes and yearly results. But getting talent is a giant piece of the puzzle as well. And (not to start this debate again, ugh), the star system is at least a useful, if flawed, measure of talent.
Virginia Tech uses the “good talent” + “great coaching” to outperform a lot of schools. But when they run into the “great talent” + “great coaching” schools—like Alabama and Saban for instance, they lose.
agreed
it seems like Va Tech has hit its wall against the faster teams in the big bowl games. They win the other bowl games vs. equal opponents, but against the big boys, it hasn’t been enough. This year, it was reported they’re recruiting like crazy because of their light class last season. So maybe the leg up will help them break through one day.
I just hope RE and staff can coach like Beamer’s crew. We’ll be alright if they do…
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
just a guess
but only thing that makes sense to me is that DM coach wanted a scholly for a player EDsall wasnt thrilled with to make DM under new coach look good or that DM coach isnt getting what he thinks is proper respect from UM. anything is possible but tough to picture any new coach, no matter how much of a red-ss would diss DM for no reason when it could be averted by a 10 minute drive.
by Lucky Horseshoe on Jul 29, 2011 7:44 PM EDT reply actions
EVERYONE!!!
Eagles got Nnamdi!! WOOP WOOP!!
RIP Lennie Bias
Hold my Vick
The rebirth of Maryland Basketball. GO TERPS
Turgeon General, Fear the Turgeon, in Turgeon we trust.
Danny O'brien=future #1 overall pick
Lesean is the "Real Slim Shady"
I wanted Nnamdi playing for the Ravens IMO
by stripesean on Jul 30, 2011 12:30 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
well who doesnt want nnamdi playing for there team?
RIP Lennie Bias
Hold my Vick
The rebirth of Maryland Basketball. GO TERPS
Turgeon General, Fear the Turgeon, in Turgeon we trust.
Danny O'brien=future #1 overall pick
Lesean is the "Real Slim Shady"
Well, this is obviously the first I've heard of...
…all of this, so my response is only preliminary, pending more investigation.
One thing I will note is that Dematha has NEVER been a favorite of mine. In both football and basketball, we get their SECOND TIER prospects. Their best players go elsewhere. Very rarely do we get a FIRST TIER player out of Dematha. And that has grated on me for years.
Hey Dematha Coaches! Are you listening? We want to know why you don’t work with us more on getting your first tier players to come to MARYLAND!
All streets to both ways. You work with us, we’ll work with you.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 29, 2011 10:06 PM EDT reply actions
get the facts first ....
looks like everyone including MD pulled a schoolie due to bad grades; DM coach decided to blame only Maryland rather than bad grades or confess all schools pulled schoolie.
I have an idea
everyone start showing up to DM practices wearing the most legit maryland football gear we own
DeMatha
I feel like I have to step in here, as someone who knows DeMatha pretty well.
It is NOT a high school coach’s job to steer players to or away from certain schools. What I have read so far in the comments insinuates that DeMatha coaches have steered their players AWAY from Maryland, which simply isn’t true. Many Maryland fans seem to believe that simply because DeMatha is so close, that we should be getting the lion’s share of their players.
Let me please explain something. Every 8th grader who comes to DeMatha with the hopes of playing basketball or football makes this decision as an all-or-nothing. They know that if they make the team, they are in a great position to continue playing the sport in college, but so very few make the teams. Stars at DeMatha tend to have their pick of schools, and many kids use that leverage to leave the area and establish their own identity.
In addition, DeMatha does NOT give out any athletic scholarships (and no, they do not give out any “wink-nudge” non-athletic scholarships). These young men and their families are willing to pay for the coaching and for the education. They know that the classes there are very difficult, and that they will not be given any special treatment. They know that simply making the team is tough, and they come out the other side better athletes, better students, and better young men.
(By the way, this is also very true at Good Counsel, Gonzaga, St. John’s, etc. I’m not trying to say that DeMatha is more morally upright than these other schools, just more so than the typical perception)
So, yes, being an athlete at DeMatha is an accomplishment, and is something to be proud of. This pride can manifest itself in many ways, but it typically comes out as the young man saying that he wants to create his own identity, in a new place, to prove to himself that he can be independent of the team name which helped make him the athlete he is. Maryland is not this change of scenery.
I do not want to come across like I’m preaching or lecturing, or that I am somehow special for knowing these people, but I do want to make something very clear. I do know both Coach Brooks and Coach Jones (basketball). Both of these men are incredible people who see themselves as teachers and mentors more than coaches. To say that they “have issues” is simply out of line.
I know all of us want every great player from everywhere to want to go to Maryland. We love UMD so much, so everyone else should share our joy, right? But please try not to judge people based on whether or not they care about Maryland on the same level we do. There’s a lot more thought and care put in these decisions than we are privy to.
Go Terps, go Stags
by kaosalso on Jul 30, 2011 3:15 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I agree with everything you said, but......
the coach should have never gone to the press with this. It makes EVERYONE look bad.
You're probably right
Most likely, this wasn’t the best way to handle it. My bet is that Coach Brooks got talked into a corner by a good journalist, and didn’t want to “no comment”. But that’s just a guess. Keep in mind, he’s trying to build other relationships (media), too.
My point was that he’s not the jerk some seem to think he is, and I know that’s not what you’re saying either.
I could see that happening,,,,,
But I do see it as, the ball is in his court, so to speak. I would be pissed if I were Edsal. I wouldn’t be surprised to see the DM coach come out in the press very soon and say the story was blown out of proportion or taken out of context some how. Neither New coach needs this to hang over their heads for very long. I hope they can work it out. Both have a lot to offer the other.
Don't buy it...
First of all, while Dematha was building it’s reputation, and foundation on the sports scene in the 1960’s, it was giving out “wink” non-athletic scholarships. And Morgan Whooten did “recruit” players to Dematha. They built their reputation, and athletic programs in all the shady ways such things are built.
Secondly, Terp fans have a right to expect that a school less than five freaking miles from campus would be great source of players. And yes, we should get the lions share. Period. The idea that our rivals come in here and take the best players, and we get the leftovers is so repugnant to me, I can’t state it in plain enough terms to get how repugnant it is to me communitated properly. Maryland is a major D1 school and there is no reason why we shouldn’t be getting our share of the best players coming out of that freaking school.
Finally, the idea that Dematha steers players away from Maryland is not the point. It’s that they do their best to get their players elsewhere. They send players away. And they do everything in their power to do so. At a minimum, I would hope that they would do their best to build these young men so that they would be here enriching OUR community. Not State College PA!
I could care less about Dematha. As far as I’m concerned, they send players to other schools, and they always will. Let their coach whine.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 3:34 AM EDT up reply actions
Point by point
1) Yes, DeMatha recruited in the ‘60s and still does now. For every sport. It’s not illegal or immoral or against any spirit of any rules. It’s a private high school, so they recruit.
2) Accusing one of the classiest men in basketball history of impropriety is false and not appreciated.
3) Why should Maryland “expect” a great source of players? Your argument seems to be “We should get the most players. Other schools take these players, and that sucks. So we should get the most players.”
4) Then, you say that it’s not the point that DeMatha tells players to go to other schools, but instead that DeMatha tells players to go to other schools…
5) DM coaches do (and should) care more about the kids’ futures than the enrichment of the local community. When what’s best for the kid matches up with “going to Maryland”, that’s when the kid is encouraged to go to Maryland.
by kaosalso on Jul 30, 2011 3:53 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
CD: absolutely right that Maryland should be getting the lion’s share of players. But it’s not DM’s fault that they’re not. It’s Maryland’s.
kaosalso: I think your DM allegiance is clouding the Wooten thing a bit. Wooten was undeniably classy. He was also not without a large amount of “impropriety.” Hell, John Wooden is one of the greatest coaches and men in history and he did his fair share of maneuvering in the blacker shades of grey. (Less nuanced men would simply say he cheated, too).
A balanced reply to this...
but I don’t buy it being Maryland’s fault. If that is so, then it was:
Lefty’s fault.
Gary’s fault
Now Turge’s fault (See Grant)
Jerry Clairborne’s fault
Bobby Ross’s fault
Joe Krivak’s fault
Mark Duffner’s fault
Ron Vanderlindon’s fault
Ralph Friedgen’s fault
And now Randy Edsall’s fault
This has been a problem for 40 years. Dematha just refuses to send it’s first tier players to the home school. It is almost a freak accident when it does happen.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 4:40 AM EDT up reply actions
You are beating a dead horse CHUCKY.
They have their blinders on and are running off the track. It is a stigmatism with DeMatha’s students on how they perceive the UMD. Apparently, going to Maryland is not the “IN THING” to do for DeMatha students. I mean 40 years and 10 different coaches. Randy has a tremendous amount of work to put in at DM to change that atmosphere. And how long has he been on board? EXACTLY!! Step back NAY SAYERS and let the man do his job.
by TwerpsNoMore on Jul 30, 2011 6:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Yes.
It is.
See below posts. DM is big enough for locale to have no point, and thereby I’m not at all surprised when Maryland doesn’t land a strong crop every year. The only way to do that is to recruit at another level. I’m not blaming them for not landing DM prospects, but I’m not blaming DM. And actually Fridge landed a lot of DM players, pretty much 1+ a year. The big ones just didn’t go to MD except Tate, but did you really expect them to?
And by the way...
I find this “It’s Maryland’s fault” a little insulting.
As was mentioned in another thread, Maryland is the only school to offer a full athletic scholarship to a paralyzed Dematha player.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 11:49 PM EDT up reply actions
They did
But it was Duffner. Duffner’s not here anymore, and his good deeds went out the window with him. People care about the people they’re interacting with, not past deeds other people did. People change, as do attitudes.
what a load
the issue is not that some great DeMatha player skips MD. It is that virtually none go to Md.It is not that some want to leave town, it is that virtually ALL want to leave town. It is not whether the coach has issues. He obviously does. He has issues with Md/Edsall and he ran to the press to whine about it instead of dealing with it between men.It is not whether a coach steers his players, we know they do. IT is not whether your post spins with your bias. IT obviously does. But that doesnt make you wrong. It just means we have to pick through what isnt germane to the issue like schollies and moral high ground and know you are wrong about the DM coach having issues. Clearly he does, and clearly he is the type to run to mommy and daddy and cry that “he started it” or Edsall “took his football and wont share”.
by Lucky Horseshoe on Jul 30, 2011 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Point by point...
1) Yes, DeMatha recruited in the ‘60s and still does now. For every sport. It’s not illegal or immoral or against any spirit of any rules. It’s a private high school, so they recruit.
It IS unethical. And it WAS illegal in many forms and in the many ways it was and IS done.
2) Accusing one of the classiest men in basketball history of impropriety is false and not appreciated.
Morgan Whooten was as shady as the best of them behind the scenes. Oh yes, he’s got a great reputation with the media and with schools OTHER than Maryland. All I know is he stocked NC State and every other Maryland rival with talented players.
3) Why should Maryland "expect" a great source of players? Your argument seems to be "We should get the most players. Other schools take these players, and that sucks. So we should get the most players."
Why should Maryland expect that its citizens come to the state university? Why should we as a community think our sons should play for the home team? Go to the home school? You might not think sending kids to Penn State is a big afront to our school, I do.
4) Then, you say that it’s not the point that DeMatha tells players to go to other schools, but instead that DeMatha tells players to go to other schools…
Dematha does it’s best to send players away. They could very easily get them scholarships at Maryland.
5) DM coaches do (and should) care more about the kids’ futures than the enrichment of the local community. When what’s best for the kid matches up with "going to Maryland", that’s when the kid is encouraged to go to Maryland.
You might think sending kids to Iowa, and Alabama, and Penn State is in the best interests of these kids. And then you get on here and slam those institutions as corrupt and everything else.
You are nothing but a Dematha grad trying to defend your school. I’ve had enough of Dematha.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 4:09 AM EDT reply actions
Of course I'm defending my school
Isn’t that what you’re doing, too?
I’m going to sleep. I’m sure I’ll read and write more in the morning. Good night.
So they're supposed to go to Maryland because they are (in some cases) from Maryland?
I dunno Chuck, that seems pretty flimsy. I mean, yeah, I’d love it too. But that’s just not the way things work anymore, if they ever did. Certainly no good reason to go on a DM rampage.
In fact, I kind of consider DM to be above their location. Think Kansas basketball or Alabama football. If they recruited locally, they’d have crap for a team. But, by their stature, they can recruit anywhere. Same thing with DM, only in reverse. They’re so big they can send kids anywhere. Locale matters nothing to DM, and it’s time to stop acting like it does.
And DM “sends” its best players away in the sense that its best players don’t go to MD. Is that orchestrated? I doubt it. I do think that a bad relationship begets another bad relationship, and it’s just never really healed, in either sport. Quite frankly, if you want to hate on a school, hate on Gilman.
I remember Dematha being controversial...
all the way back to the Lefty era. Lefty was one of the best recruiters in the nation, and the only good player he got out of that school was Adrian Branch. And I don’t count Dutch Morely as a good player. And it wasn’t for lack of trying. It was a major controversy, all the way back then. And the way it was phrased back then was, “Morgan Whooten is sending his players away from Maryland.”
Where there is smoke, there is fire. There is no reason why almost every good player coming out of there should want to leave the area. Whatever happened to parents wanting to see their kids stay home so they can watch them play?
I don’t buy it. Certainly we don’t need Dematha. We don’t get most of the players out of there anyway.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 4:45 AM EDT up reply actions
DM kids aren't all local
Some of these kids commute long distances or move to the area just for High School. You can’t count them all as locals.
I think you have DM confused with Montrose or Oak Hill
DeMatha is all local (DMV area). Furthest many of these players go is about an hour, which is pretty significant. But for national brand basketball-factories like Montrose or Oak Hill, players come from across the country or across the globe to play there. After all, Greivis (Montrose) was direct from Venezuela and Pe’Shon (Oak Hill) was from LA.
Did you get kicked out of DeMatha or something
What proof do you have that Morgan Wooten was shady. Also why would DeMatha steer players to Maryland when Maryland didn’t even interview Wooten for the mens basketball position when Lefty was fired – instead they hired Bob Wade.
Just win football games this year
Randy can go and ask anybody if they want to be a Terp.
+1
With regards football and basketball recruiting, they are apples and oranges. In basketball, I really want us to lock down the area. For football, our “area” is really much larger. The entire region to be exact. Get players from NY all the way down to GA. And if you win games, I could care less where you get them.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I actually think the reverse is true
For basketball, we’re big enough to recruit nationally. If nothing else we should hold down the area, but between Turge and Bino’s Texas connections, Bino and Spinelli’s NE prep connections, and Hill with some connections to NC, we should be able to recruit essentially anyone. Much like Syracuse or Kansas.
In football, we don’t have that luxury. I do think we need to grab players from the entire region, but our only real chance at getting an elite prospect is if they come from the immediate area. Spence is from southern PA, traditionally a Terps-strong area, and I think if you go any further out, the elites won’t give us the time of day. With Diggs, Goldman, Jones, etc., our location gets us in the door. So strong relationships are much more important locally in football than basketball.
by Ben Broman on Jul 30, 2011 10:23 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Of course, I'm speaking traditionally...
Traditionally speaking, when we say we want Maryland basketball to lock down our area, we are talking about the Maryland/DC/Nova areas.
In football, we recruit mostly up and down the entire eastern seaboard. Not 5 star studs mind you, but we get players from the entire region.
Of course with the advent of Mark Turgeon and his staff, basketball is going nationally again in a big way.
Of course… eeh, not going to kep going…
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 11:53 PM EDT up reply actions
most coaches
would tell you that there is enough talent within 200 miles radius of College Park to win a National Championship. Md needs to recruit Maryland. But don’t undervalue players from NY, NJ, Pa,De, and Va. Going away to school can be as far away as going to a nearby state.
This is a non-issue.
Dematha players are over-rated. Out of 11 NBA players that came out of Dematha none except for Adrian Dantley amounted to anything and he was never a winner. Dantley was probably not much better than Keith Booth playing in an era of smaller weaker players a 6’5" power forward could thrive in the NBA. UMD had 3 of the 11 players that played in the NBA. thats 30% and I’m sure thats more than any other school Jerod Mustaf was probably the highest rated recruit to ever come out and we got him. Of course Dematha players are usually poor students, soft players, sometimes have shockingly poor judgement. Mustaf appears to have murdered somebody. Branch had a drug arrest in college. Garrison was a big man afraid of contact and a poor student. Simpkins was drastically over-rated, pouted when he couldn’t compete at the highest level and had 450 parking tickets. Hawkeye whitney was convicted of kidnapping and went to jail. BFD…the players are not that important. In football UMD has gotten 2 of the 7 nfl players from Dematha and probably has their bets player ever in Tate. Thats fine. My alma mater Churchill High (hardly a football power) has had 4 NFL players and 2 were pro bowlers better than the Dematha players so its just fine getting Dematha’s 2nd tier players and developing them to contribute since their best players are usually over-rated and trouble. My apologies to the Dematha Grad because I think its a great school but I am not impressed with their graduates post-high school (except Tate). thank you very much, thank you very much and………..thank you very much.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 11:32 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
haha 11 NBA players
thats pretty significant…didnt bother reading your post after that..we aren’t a NBA team so why would that matter if they didnt do anything in the NBA?
by tmoneyttime1 on Jul 30, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions
Brian Westbrook?
Edwin Williams?
Josh Wilson?
All high-character guys, the last two went through MD to the NFL.
And at one point two years ago, DeMatha had 8 NFL players at the same time, let alone all time – easily the most of any high school in the entire country. Similar to Montrose in basketball.
excellent post
backed up with a pretty accurate assessment of the DM grads. One thing you’re off on though – Duane had 550 tickets – lmao
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 30, 2011 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh....name another school with...
all of these as their best players… murderer, 450 parking tickets, drug arrests, kidnapping conviction, high percentage of poor academic records….I’m sure you can find lots of players from other schools that can compete without the drama.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
btw
Austin Freeman just got a DUI….that didn’t take long.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Definition:
A straw man is a component of an argument and is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent’s position. To “attack a straw man” is to create the illusion of having refuted a proposition by replacing it with a superficially similar yet unequivalent proposition (the “straw man”), and refuting it, without ever having actually refuted the original position.
Repeat: Do you know these kids? At all? Or do you just go based on the news you hear of the few?
Dematha Basketball players have had a negative impact on UMD basketball.
And they don’t win either. I’m sure Jerod Mustaf has a great character, I just don’t know him well enough. Maybe Character is a strong word to use and I take it back in respect of your objection however, these 1st tier guys at Dematha serve up way too much drama and not enough talent. That said however, I like the 2nd tier players and I think they are more likely to be a part of a winning program. I have always noticed that the Dematha highly ranked recruits have been vastly over-rated and thereby hurt your programs reputation when they don’t develop.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Thank you
for toning down “character”, which is what upset me.
You are entitled to your opinion for “overrated”. I disagree, but that’s a sports argument, not a personality argument.
I GUARANTEE...
jeremy grant will be an under performer and a sulker.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
So much for that goodwill
Jerami is a GREAT kid from a wonderful family. In addition, he’s a great student. On the court, he plays with a lot of energy on both ends of the floor and is the opposite of a sulker.
Obviously, “under performer” depends on your expectation, but I doubt he’ll be lumped in the category you came up with earlier.
by kaosalso on Jul 30, 2011 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
once they
figure out they won’t be going to the NBA, and start wearing scooby-doo shirts, they all sulk.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 5:02 PM EDT up reply actions
one fine point
one can form an opinion on character based upon actions and deeds, no?
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 30, 2011 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions
Some of these conspiracy theories are so dumb.
Kenny Tate was the most highly regarded football player to come out of DM in a while. (Interestingly enough, the last DM player that was on the same level of Tate might have been Strachan, another MD commitment.) The best player at one of the area’s best schools. Turned down offers everywhere to come to Maryland. That in itself should be enough to make everyone here EXTREMELY happy, considering the state of MD football in the past five years. We aren’t even the best in the ACC—a conference that is not what it used to be.
I love MD sports, but don’t try and tell me we should be landing more athletes from a high school that has the #2 athletic department in the nation (it’s probably not that high anymore). As Ben said, the DM influence reaches out to so many schools that numbers alone make this impossible. Good Counsel is undoubtedly the team to beat in the WCAC and has many more prospects at this point, but I can’t imagine DM falling too far behind. I agree the new football coach was stupid to go about this the way he did, but Edsall should at least be out there.
I don’t know if there is a grudge between DM coaches and MD coaches (I really doubt there is), but neither does anybody else here. Sure, everyone is allowed to speculate, but saying we should just say “screw DM” based off some hunch you have is just plain dumb.
Strachan....
Blew off UMD to go to Penn State. Then he paralyzed himself jumping into the surf at bethany beach. When he couldn’t play anymore UMD offered him a scholarship and extended all courtesy to make him feel part of the Terp family and he now does color on UMD broadcasts. With the help of UMD he has a law degree and is loved by the Terp Family. He was not going to play for us when he was healthy. For this…..Dematha should kiss the ground we walk on.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
You're right.
I had to look it up—didn’t realize I had it wrong all these years. Also read about the rest of his life : we did recruit him, he did decide to go elsewhere (they didn’t use as harsh a phrase as “blowing us off”), and he does have a law degree with a lot of help from MD. In fact, we went so far as to give him an athletic scholarship here. To me, Strachan should kiss the ground we walk on (and essentially that is what he is doing through his broadcasting). Anyway, props…you were right.
Most people rag on...
Mark Duffner, but I have always known that doing what he did with Strachan was about the classiest thing a Maryland football coach has ever done.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
We love Kenny Tate
maybe Kenny will be able to get some DM guys to come to UMD due to his great experience and the preparation for the pros.
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 30, 2011 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I'd say this post has done its job
And UMD and DM will kiss & make up in response to all us fans.
exactly
all comers welcome – if you have a good attitude, good grades, and some game – let’s roll!!!
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jul 30, 2011 6:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, and their best players...
…will still NOT come to Maryland. I’ve lived with this for forty years, so I think I can predict that with certainty.
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 30, 2011 10:15 PM EDT up reply actions
dude...
we have gotten 30% of their pro players in both basketball and football. Not to mention Tate who is probably going to be the best player they ever produced. Most of their top tier players are dissapointments anyway.
by TERPLANDLORD on Jul 30, 2011 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Dudes, relax
It’s just one story. There are other WCAC schools.
Besides that, where are the good football schools in Maryland?

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