Taking a Maryland Basketball Debate to the boards
by Matt Mil on Jun 30, 2011 1:57 AM EDT
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PrintAnswer these poll questions for me to end a debate I am having with a fellow Maryland fan who for some reason loves Adrian Bowie over Eric Hayes.
Since I will not be able to post more than one poll these are other questions:
What is a more impressive performance?
Eric Hayes scoring 20 points against eventual national champion Duke or Adrian Bowie scoring 22 against a 16-15 Virginia team?
Who was more of a focal point of our offense?
Jordan Williams his sophomore year with a supporting cast of Tucker, Bowie, Mosely, Stoglin, Howard or the General with two 1000 point scorers who had their best scoring years during his senior season?
After their respective sophomore years who would have been an earlier draft pick Jordan Williams or Greivis Vasquez?
My answers:
Poll: Eric Hayes
20 Points against Duke
Jordan was more of a focal point his sophomore year than GV during his senior season was since GV had an unquestionably better supporting cast
Jordan was an early second round pick and projected late first early second, while GV honestly might have been a late second maybe undrafted
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Bowie had the defense, athleticism, driving ability, and passing
Eric Hayes had shooting and well, nothing else
by stripesean on Jul 3, 2011 1:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Hayes, Vasquez
Hayes definately was more of a factor for Maryland basketball, and if last year showed anything, it is that without a lockdown 3-point threat, we cannot compete for an ACC title. As for Vasquez-Williams, vasquez had to fight against much more hate than Jordan and additionally was what Maryland stands for, passion, excitement, unbelieveable plays, and the fact that poing guard is the quarterback of the offense. Jordan had much better numbers when he had vasquez and hayes taking much of the attention away, and while they were on the same team vasquez demonstrated his place on top. Jordan was a great collegiate player, but much of that was due to the lack of talented bigs he faced and the 2010 senior class providing support and taking attention off of him his freshman year
by Turgeonator on Jun 30, 2011 2:20 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I have to agree with this point
Remembrance isn’t always a good thing. We might remember Bowie for his inability to live up to our expectations more than Hayes’ quiet but solid contributions.
Last years team will not...
be remembered at all. Except for the fact that it was a team that didn’t make the top 100 teams and ended the season with an ACC tournament loss. And who remembers teams like that?
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jun 30, 2011 3:44 AM EDT reply actions
Adrian Bowie? Please. You play enough games you are bound to have one good one. Call it the blind squirrel finding an acorn theory.
by Darrell Green Fan on Jun 30, 2011 7:38 AM EDT reply actions
This comment got me to thinking...
are there actual blind squirrels? Haha.
Yes, they are the ones you see squooshed in the middle of the road.
by 1 proud terp on Jun 30, 2011 8:06 AM EDT up reply actions
And I usually say "Swish" when I squoosh one!" lol
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jun 30, 2011 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Probably not
Maybe some are born that way, but I doubt squirrels have seeing eye dogs or walking sticks to help them in the wild. They probably die right away.
Back on the Sweed train. Choo Choo!
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
by John Stephens on Jun 30, 2011 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions
AB was good sophomore year and showed flashes of greatness
He could have been more effective with a better supporting cast. Prob best as a bench “changeup” type of player who could drive and get to the rim.
Honestly JWill pouting and dogging it at the end of the year had a lot to do with the end of season swoon.
This
Jwill lost his edge coming down the stretch. Once he broke Elmore’s double double record, he seem to put it in cruise control with eyes on jumping pro.
by 1 proud terp on Jun 30, 2011 9:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Vasquez over everyone except for:
Bias and Dixon.
by TerpMasterX on Jun 30, 2011 9:21 AM EDT via mobile reply actions
IDK
I might put Walt Williams over GV for his loyalty when days were the darkest. Also, having multiple games of 40+ is pretty badass.
by 1 proud terp on Jun 30, 2011 9:15 PM EDT up reply actions
John Lucas says hello...
Three time All American and Number One NBA pick. Not just first round, but NUMBER ONE in the first round.
Oh, and Joe Smith? National Freshman of the Year? The next year, National Player of the Year?
McFly!
Maryland basketball has been a sleeping Giant. The Giant is waking up.
by CharlesDriesell on Jul 1, 2011 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions
Vasquez over these Terps?
Len Elmore, John Lucas, Albert King, Walt Williams, Buck Williams, Joe Smith, Adrian Branch, Nik Caner-Medley. One of my favorites is Brad Davis. What and NBA career.
Additionally
Bowie played on a sub par team when he finbaly got some playing time, which might have negatively influenced his stats
by stripesean on Jul 3, 2011 1:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Tight poll
I’m really intrigued to see which way it will go with it being so close.
Back on the Sweed train. Choo Choo!
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
by John Stephens on Jun 30, 2011 9:38 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I actually might remember Bowie more, but for wrong reasons
GV might overshadow EH.
Naaaaaah.
As for the others, Hayes scoring 20 for sure. Not necessarily because of the points, but in the way he did it. He was almost flawless that game.
I actually think GV was a bigger focal point of the offense. Everything went through him. He didn’t always score, but it was because of him that everyone else did. He average more PPG than Jordan and always had the ball in his hands. The offense relied on him much more than it relied on Jordan.
Jordan would’ve been picked higher by a mile. Not even close. GV gets picked really late in the second round, or maybe goes undrafted.
I meant
if you were gameplanning to stop maryland during GV’s senior year your entire defense wasn’t just stopping GV you had to worry about hayes on the perimeter and Landon stepping out
but Jordan his sophomore year was more of a focal point in a defensive gameplan because if you stopped Landon, you stopped Maryland
NBA Draft
I don’t remember the 2008 mock drafts, but wasn’t Vasquez at least pegged as a first-rounder in 2007 after he nearly had a triple-double on Duke? (the whole obsession with potential). The other thing to consider would be that Vasquez had a full draft class against to compete, and if Williams had to face the likes of Sullinger, Jones, Henson, not to mention the players who always leave too early (ala Born Ready, Selby), he, too, would have been late 2nd. Not saying you’re wrong, but I remember scouts being pretty high on Vasquez while he still had “potential”.
by LonghornTerp02 on Jun 30, 2011 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions
2009 mocks I recall
had Greivis as a 2nd rounder. That’s why he stayed. I never saw any mock having him 1st round. Mocks won’t show his placement because he withdrew his name before the last mocks came out in 2009.
"firegary, go sit under the basket at one of FCHS's games next year so...
Seth can flush one right down your throat you little trouble making hatin’ weasel…"
by bball purist on Jun 30, 2011 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Bowie might be remembered in 10 years
but it won’t be for anything good….
Poll. Hayes – He was frustrating in how many shots he never took, but I’ll remember him fondly, especially after this season without a deep threat. Plus, I’ll remember Bowie more for “Anthony” than his game, if at all; I’ll remember Hayes for the ACC Championship with the senior trio.
Q1. Hayes – Loaded question, but obvious answer… at least Duke plays tough defense.
Q2. Vasquez – I’m actually going to say Williams wasn’t the true focal point of the offense by years end; it was Stoglin. When we needed baskets at the end of games (Vermont, GT, and, of course, Duke come immediately to mind) who did we look to in 2010? (Granted, the inbounds went to Tucker in the GT game, but only because the defense mobbed Vasquez.) Crucial games last year (Villanova, much of the ACC slate), I remember Stoglin battling late and Williams disappearing far too often. Here are some stats to back my answer (I used ESPN for ppg, KenPom for the rest)…
2010-2011
Williams 16.9ppg, 24.0% possessions used, 24.6% shots
Stoglin 11.4, 26.9%, 26.8%
2009-2010
Vasquez 19.5, 30.6%, 29.8%
Millbourne 12.5, 20.1%, 22.7%
Hayes 11.1, 16.2%, 16.6%
Stoglin’s stats are a bit skewed, but what did he average down the stretch? It’s also easier for the offense to flow through Vasquez and Stoglin since they brought it up the court. Just because Vasquez had a better supporting cast, doesn’t mean he wasn’t “The Man” (and he most definitely was). Similarly (this may be flawed logic), Walker was clearly more of a focal point for UConn than Delaney for VT, despite the comparative strength of the supporting cast.
like I said before
I meant the Gameplan for stopping MD GV senior year was stop GV but also Hayes and Landon… while for the majority of this year it was stop Jordan you stop MD so thats what I meant by focal point… the focal point of a defensive plan against maryland
Not sure where you said it...
Are you also nowaxxy22? Anyway, the way you say it is true… Williams was a bigger focal point of opposing defenses (after all, last year you only had Williams and Stoglin as real threats, whereas in 2010 you had Vasquez, Millbourne, Hayes, Williams, so you couldn’t play to stop 1/4 whereas, last year, you could double Williams and play to stop 1/2). However, Vasquez was the bigger focal point of our offense. Semantics, I guess, but I originally gave you 2/3 :).
by LonghornTerp02 on Jun 30, 2011 9:19 PM EDT up reply actions
adrian bowie
will either be remembered for the wrong reasons…or forgotten
I'm wondering if the Terp fans' souring of Bowie(montrose christian)
played any part in Justin Anderson’s decision to bail when he got the chance.
Doubt it
Bowie had all the chances he could ask for last season and only came through in a handful of games.
I love Adrian Bowie's game
the speed, solid D, lefty stroke…but it never developed anywhere near its potential. I was counting on him for 10+ ppg and 4+ apg this year, instead he got outplayed by the incoming freshmen.
The 6 people who voted for AB over Hayes
must all have the last name “Bowie”
by 1 proud terp on Jul 2, 2011 8:37 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
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